Marketing, Mental Health & Women in the Trades: The Story Behind Trademark Digital

Ever wondered how trade professionals can turn their real-world skills into a thriving online brand? In this episode, Stacey and Jack from Trademark Digital share their incredible journey from Jack working in the trades industry to launching a successful digital marketing agency with Stacey’s expertise, that helps tradespeople grow their businesses. 

They get real about what it takes to stand out online — from building authentic connections, tackling the challenges women face in the trades, to raising mental health awareness and using social media marketing the right way. 

Stacey and Jack’s chemistry and complementary skill sets make this conversation both inspiring and practical. Whether you’re an electrician, builder, or small business owner, Stace aka Stick and Jack have all the tips on branding, networking, and using digital marketing to showcase your craft. 

If you’re passionate about the trades, entrepreneurship, and personal growth, this episode is for you. 

🔔 Dont forget to click that follow button to stay alerted to future episodes!

Key Takeaways 

• Stacey and Jack combined their knowledge and expertise in both the trades and marketing. 
• Authenticity is key in building a brand. 
• Networking is crucial for growth in the trades. 
• Mental health awareness is important in the industry. 
• Women in trades face unique challenges. 
• Social media can be a powerful tool for tradespeople. 
• Marketing requires consistency and patience. 
• Building a strong partnership enhances business success. 
• Every conversation can lead to new opportunities. 
• The journey in trades is rewarding despite challenges. 

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Instagram: @lifeofafemaletradie_ 

Tiktok: @loaftpodcast 

Facebook: Life Of A Female Tradie 

Youtube: @lifeofafemaletradiepodcast 

Follow guest:

Instagram: trademarkdigitaluk

Website: https://www.trademarkdigital.co.uk/

Chapters

00:00 Introduction of guests 

03:51 Transition from Trade to Marketing 

07:39 Building a Strong Partnership 

13:19 Navigating Challenges in the Trade Industry 

18:58 The Dynamics of Being a Female in a Male-Dominated Field 

23:58 The Journey of Recovery and Growth 

25:31 Authenticity in Branding 

28:45 The Power of Social Media in Marketing 

31:23 Networking and Building Relationships 

36:09 Future Plans and Events 

41:07 Choosing a Trade: Insights and Reflections 

49:04 Thanks for listening, like, follow for more 

Transcript

Stacey & Jack (00:20)

I'm Jack. I'm Stick, Stace but known by Stick in the industry. Yeah, everyone knows you as Stick Trademark Digital, so we run a marketing agency. We've also got this designed specifically for the trades and we also fell into talent management as well. So yeah, we manage various influencers or...

Laura (00:37)

Mmm.

Stacey & Jack (00:43)

content creators, how they prefer to be called in this industry. So that sort of fell into our lap. That was a path that took us rather than us taking it. Yeah, and it's proven to be quite a fun one, to be honest. So our business model as a company, as months go on, is changing drastically. But one thing that has kind of stood firm is that it's just such a little family and...

Laura (01:00)

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (01:06)

everybody that we've got on our books and everybody that works with us and all of our industry friends everybody's just so aligned and if you do it right it is. Yeah now ethos is we're going to the top but we all want to go to the top together. 100 % Yeah so there's room at the top for everyone. Indeed.

Laura (01:21)

Love that, love that.

Amazing. Absolutely.

for those that haven't come across you yet, I don't know how that's even possible because you're everywhere, but in a good way, obviously. But for those that don't know too much about you, what are your backgrounds?

Stacey & Jack (01:32)

thank you.

So my background is in the trade. So I'm a carpenter by trade. So I've done that for probably 18 years, bar sort of the last year of starting trademark or the last sort of year and a half. I am doing bits still. Like I've obviously still got my trade. Yeah, I'm doing, when I say doing bits, I'm doing my house and I'm doing my family's houses. But as far as doing it for a job.

Laura (01:49)

Wow.

I am.

Stacey & Jack (02:06)

Trademark is my only job now, but I've been doing was doing carpentry for about 18 years loved the trade and I think it's a great skill to have and It's definitely good. I've got family all in the trade. So everyone in my family is some sort of trade in one way or another so It's really handy, you know, especially for like now where I'm doing my house. I've got plumbers electricians plasterers Me as a carpenter. You get it all done under one hat

Laura (02:34)

Yeah, of course, definitely. Well, that's it, it? Yeah, and carpentry is a popular one amongst guests as well. yeah, definitely.

Stacey & Jack (02:36)

I've saved a lot of money doing it. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, I love

the trades like it's a rewarding skill to have. But it's a hard trade and you need a lot of tools, a lot of money spent.

Laura (02:48)

Ugh.

That's it, yeah. So it's a big outlay, isn't

And ongoing as well, you got to...

Stacey & Jack (02:57)

ongoing yeah because you gotta

maintain the tools and also buy the blades for each individual tool and various other bits and pieces but yeah I got into that I mean how far back do you want to go?

Laura (03:08)

Well,

what made you choose a trade? Let's have a go at that one. That's always a popular topic.

Stacey & Jack (03:11)

Right, so my

dad, he had a building company and when I left school, they never thought I'd be, they always thought I'd be like a broker or something like that, but I ended up leaving school and becoming, at the start, an electrician. I was going to college to do electrics and then I'd done a bit of work with a carpenter on one of my dad's sites and I said to my dad, said, I wanna do this, I'm not interested in electrics, I wanna do carpentry, so then.

Woke up a couple of days later and he's kitted my whole toolkit out, which I was very lucky. Yeah, changed colleges, started going to a carpentry college and that was it. Ended up slowly learning the trade. And then eventually, it's a hard one to learn, but eventually it all falls into place, as with any trade. It starts out really hard, it's hard to learn and then a few years down the line, all of a sudden it starts making sense and you get good at it and then you master it, you know?

Laura (03:42)

Wow.

cool.

Stacey & Jack (04:05)

Now you own a marketing company. Now I've walked away from that and I own a marketing agency that manages talent. Yeah. Yeah.

Laura (04:05)

Yeah. There we go. There we go. And what

made the change marketing?

Stacey & Jack (04:20)

So I had some health issues about coming up two years in December. I had some health issues and I basically it basically stopped me doing my job basically so I had to have a year out. I wasn't the man I was before.

Laura (04:28)

Okay.

Stacey & Jack (04:40)

And at the same time, stick, I had a company, a carpentry joinery company with a partner, and I obviously had to have a year out and stick around the time that I went off, come on for my other company. she was putting work in and she doing really well and everyone wanted to snatch her and take her off of us. she said, like the whole way along, she was saying, there's an opening here. We need to open something up. So we was like,

I was skeptical and obviously I don't know anything about it. She was like, no, but this is perfect partnership to basically open Trademark. So she saw the vision for Trademark a good year before it even started. And then yes, I had to have a bit of time off and then I come back. I wasn't what I was when I come back and she was like, do you know what? Let's do it. Let's just go for it and open it up. So I was like, all right.

Laura (05:22)

Okay.

Stacey & Jack (05:35)

Let's do it. Let's go for it. And best decision I ever made because we love every minute of it. We're always laughing. We literally just sat here didn't we? And said, like, it's Monday. We've been here, what, an hour and a half. We've not stopped laughing. A bit than that now. We've been here for about two hours. But yeah, we've just been cracking up the whole time. Like, who... It's not often you can wake up in the morning and get excited to go to work after the weekend. So I'm very thankful for that. Yeah.

Laura (06:02)

Amazing, amazing. I

love that, absolutely. It's got to be something that you love to do and be around people that you enjoy being around as well. That's a massive part, isn't it, of your working environment, for sure.

Stacey & Jack (06:14)

Yeah. Yeah. massively. Yeah.

I that's a big thing for me because obviously before working with Jack, I was a freelance marketer. So my job was quite lonely. So I worked from home. I wasn't client facing. I was just project facing and project that sort of led, was sort of leading projects. So I'm wasted not being in front of people. And it just made me realize how lonely I was. And then obviously when I

Laura (06:26)

Okay.

Stacey & Jack (06:42)

I started taking on other clients, Jack's old company being one of them and it was literally just up the road for me. So I sort of started knocking about the workshop and it wasn't my thing at all. I sort of walked in there and was like, oh. Dusty old workshop with two blokes running around. She's walked in and she's like, oh, not wanting to touch nothing. I remember they offered me a tea and I was like, I've never seen a builder's mug

Laura (06:57)

You

Haha

yeah, they're rank, they?

Stacey & Jack (07:09)

I'd never seen a

builder's mug before and I was like, no, you're right. And then by the end of it, I was like, for me, was like I went from that extreme to then being with my two mates and making cool shit and marketing it and then getting a lot of attention off of the back of how we were doing it to then, you know, it was so rewarding for me. was just, it was a big sacrifice because I sacrificed a lot in terms of my financial situation, but

Money doesn't buy you happiness. And to be fair, the timing of what happened with Jack's health, I literally started the day before. He had a stroke. So it was like, it was just the universe. We was meant to align at that time. And the rest has just been history. We've had a really shitty couple of years and there's been a lot to get through to get here now. But we say it every day, like what has happened happened for a reason. it's brought us to...

Laura (07:47)

wow.

Mm.

Stacey & Jack (08:08)

trademark and it's brought us to where we are now. And I think we've built this company through so much grit and like, it's not trauma, that's such a lot. But it was traumatic, you know, it really was. And when you actually break down what's actually happened and all the little things that we went through to get here, like that's why we're so close. And that's why our bond is how it is and our friendship is how it is because we've gone through so much to get to where we are now. In such a short period of time.

Laura (08:19)

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (08:35)

It's funny because when she first come into the yard and she wouldn't touch nothing and dusty old workshop, two blokes running around, dirty mugs, she's drinking tea out of dirty mugs and then a few months down the line, I'll never forget, she's like throwing big old sheets of MDF about, she's pulling tools out, we used to call her Shaper Stace because she'd whip the shaper out and start engraving something and then she would go and resin it and by the end of it, you could say that she's got a trade, know, it's like she was...

Laura (08:43)

You

Wow.

Stacey & Jack (09:03)

half a joiner by the time she left that workshop. Yeah, and I say it now, I do little bits at home and that, and I'll text him and be like, thank you for teaching me. I would never have known, he could say to me now, go down to the shop and get me a PZ2 bit or whatever. And I'd know what it is that learned. For me, that knowledge, I love to learn. I'm always wanting to learn something new. And I genuinely believe that like, Jack's...

Laura (09:06)

Play

Stacey & Jack (09:29)

come from being a tradesman on the tools and never really picking up a laptop apart from the admin of a business to now his whole world has gone digital. And my world has always been digital and I've never been hands on. So we've both thought we've given each other really, we've both got so much knowledge from each other. And that's why that's where trademark come from. Jack is the trade, I'm and we sort of them together and it's a really unusual combination. But I think

We've branded Trademark through us and people buy people not product. you know, we've really, think everyone says it, you know, we are the two of us. And it's an issue like for a lot of people, because we have it all the time at trade shows, people try and split us up and we're like, yeah, they're like, you come with me and Jack goes there and I'm like, no, like we don't do things on our own. Like we are the two of us.

Laura (10:15)

Really?

Stacey & Jack (10:23)

It's more frequent than you. Yeah, it happens more often than you think. Yeah. I think that kind of goes down to the female, like being a woman in the trades as well. Like I'm heavily protected, not just by Jack, but you know, he's got a big family, all of our friends, you know, it's a very male dominated industry. So when a woman comes into that, it can either go two ways. But for me, I've got a lot of good people around me. Some men, I guess. Well, I think it's also

Laura (10:27)

Okay.

Stacey & Jack (10:52)

what obviously the friendship that we've got, obviously business partners and best friends, people that see it like want that, you know? And it's a rare find, especially because, I've got a business partner who's a girl, obviously my missus is fine with it and that's a rare find. But people, I wouldn't wanna use the word envious of it.

Laura (11:04)

Yeah, absolutely.

Stacey & Jack (11:16)

But it is something to be envied, you know? The partnership that we got, the friendship that we've got.

Laura (11:20)

Definitely, definitely, I mean...

For sure. And how long have you guys known each other? How long have you been friends?

Stacey & Jack (11:27)

Literally two years. It's like we've known each other our whole life. Honestly, it was like the universe just put me there the day before his stroke. That's where the word stick comes from because I just stuck around, I didn't leave. Sometimes I've got friends from growing up, but you just meet people sometimes and they're just your people. It is literally like that.

It's happened. It's got, it's for such a short period of time, but I feel like what we went through added another 20 years onto that friendship.

Laura (11:58)

Yeah, I can imagine. mean, being male female duo, especially part of the trade industry is definitely, something to be admired because of how close you are. I would have said you'd have been mates for, yeah, 20 odd years for sure. Definitely. You've got a really good bond and

Stacey & Jack (12:17)

Yeah.

Laura (12:21)

you can tell that you really understand how each other works

Stacey & Jack (12:24)

Yeah, that's took time because I think we've both been through quite big things in our lives over the last couple of years as well. So we've not only had to go through kind of coming out of an old company, starting a new company, growing a company, marketing a company, selling a company, selling the branding. But we've also had to go through massive life things with each other as well. is when you we've done so many of these podcasts. Now, when you sit and you talk about it, it makes me emotional because

Laura (12:45)

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (12:53)

Like it is, it's just been such a journey. It's so cliche saying it all the time, but honestly, like I can't even begin to tell you the things that we've had to deal with. So it does, it kind of really kind of glues that friendship and you know, I'm grateful for that. I'm not an easy one to deal with every single day, ever. mean, I'm learning a lot about ADHD. A of a lot. It's funny, I was talking to my mate about it the other day and he's got it and...

and we were talking about it and I was just, because obviously sticks, I absolutely riddled up to the nines with it. I really understand it now, whereas before I didn't. I was talking to my mate about it and I was giving him a lot of healthy advice, because I had a lot of advice to give because obviously I've learned a lot about it with stick, you know. So yeah, so he's obviously trying to understand things, this, that and the other and.

Laura (13:32)

Okay.

Stacey & Jack (13:42)

about how hyper focus and all these different things about it. well, like going from being in, he was in partnership with a man in the trades to then in partnership with a woman in the trade. Like it's very different dynamic. you're not like he's and I'm very not, I'm actually not like all over the place. quite, I'm quite a very positive person generally, but it's like that's been hard, doesn't it? Like. No, I wouldn't say it's been hard at all. I think it's been quite refreshing.

Laura (13:53)

Yeah.

Yeah? Understanding the whole ups and downs of emotions and stuff. Yeah. Are you not? you're lucky.

Stacey & Jack (14:12)

Yeah.

Yeah, I no, it's been, she's not actually that bad. just has her moments. She

has her moments, but no, I thought you meant going from like a male partnership to a female partnership. With like emotions and stuff. I'm not a massively emotional kind of man, which probably most men aren't. yeah, and my good woman as well, she's not really massively emotional either. So I've never really had to deal with a woman's emotions.

Laura (14:43)

Okay. It's one of those things, isn't it? That's within the trades, it's something we have to talk about a bit more along with mental health. Yeah, absolutely.

Stacey & Jack (14:43)

I'm getting better.

Mental health movement yeah. Yeah. It's definitely

been made more aware recently.

Laura (14:56)

with that, how do you think the views are within the industry in regards to mental health and women in the trades? know

Stacey & Jack (15:08)

I'm going

to use a really good example for this one. So one of our clients is a female. And obviously we have a duty of care, not just as her management and her agents, but you know, as friends. And what we have seen by managing her account is that men seem to instantly feel that it's okay to in certain situations, and this isn't all men, it's some.

Laura (15:10)

Go for it.

Stacey & Jack (15:36)

to be able to sexualize the fact that she is a woman and messaging the most obscene voice notes that are just at like seven, eight o'clock at night and they think that's okay. And then you could take that how you wanna take that, but how that could potentially affect someone's mental health and make them anxious. Because you see a lot of these people at trade shows and events, it's a very tight-knit community.

Laura (15:54)

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (16:05)

That for me isn't okay. In all fairness, you get a lot of it as well, don't you? But I'm a certain way and I think you have to be a certain way. But there are some women who I know personally in this industry that are quite vulnerable and quite timid. I have to be the way I am because all of my clients are men. I've grown up with boys as my friends as well, so I know how to take it. you kind of have to just...

Laura (16:08)

None.

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (16:31)

you have to just give it as good as you get. But there are some women that aren't like that. And I think that it's, yeah, just because you're a woman in this industry doesn't mean that you are instantly open for sexual banter or kind of people thinking it's okay to send voice notes at seven, eight o'clock at night that are quite creepy. There's a line that has to be drawn.

Laura (16:37)

Absolutely.

Exactly.

100 % because, sorry, no, exactly, exactly, they're not. I think the end of the day, us female tradies are only trying to share our work and share our skills with the world, just like the male counterparts of the trade are. And yeah, it's a very difficult aspect from a female perspective to deal with

Stacey & Jack (17:00)

But, never mind about that.

Laura (17:28)

you do get these uncomfortable comments and voice notes and yeah it's...

Stacey & Jack (17:33)

But then there is a flip side because we are doing a growth campaign for one of our other clients at the moment and there's a little bit of a sales driven motive with that. And I know and I think the guys know that by me making those calls is going to get us further because there are some business elements whereby if a woman approaches a male dominated office or industry you're going to get further along.

Laura (17:39)

Okay.

Stacey & Jack (18:01)

in business because you are a woman. Yeah. So I know that me making them phone calls and me being the way I am and me being very forthcoming from a business element, like whether that's right or wrong to assume that, but I think from what we've seen when Jack or the client has made those calls, we've got a lot more knockbacks than when I've made the calls. So it depends how you look at that. And I think is that motive? You could look at it as in you've got great spiel.

Laura (18:04)

Mmm.

Stacey & Jack (18:31)

But coming from you, you definitely get a lot more. Yeah, because I've got a way with how I am, especially with men, because you have to know how to kind of have that kind of back and forward banter and you've got to know how to take it. So if there's a flip side to that, suppose if you want to put yourself forward and there are women in the trades that really use the fact that they're a woman.

Laura (18:58)

they do.

Stacey & Jack (18:58)

to get what they want on Instagram. And I'm fully

here for it because I'm fully here for women believing in themselves, feeling good about themselves, feeling like they can wear tight little hot pants and a crop top on camera and still do their trade with their still toe cap boots on. But that's your prerogative. If you're happy to do that and you feel confident then I'm fully, fully here for every single woman there. And why shouldn't they be? know, men wear shorts. Men take their top off on site.

Laura (19:17)

Yeah.

Yeah, that's true. Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (19:27)

why can't women do the same? But then you look at the comments and then they instantly get bashed. Right, you know, there's always a spin with women. you're never going to really get to the bottom of that what's right and what's wrong. I don't think.

Laura (19:33)

Yeah.

No, it's a,

no, I agree. It's a very, it's a very difficult line to tread, isn't it? And yeah, you, you, you've got no control over people wanting to comment. At the end of the day, you're putting your content out there to the world and that, that is, it's open for, for comment and you know, that's just part and parcel of it. yeah.

Stacey & Jack (20:04)

Yeah. But

I think going back to the partnership thing, I think that it works. It's a very good dynamic because we've been in some meetings whereby I had a couple of big meetings when Jack was on holiday and we very nearly didn't get them across the line because their concerns was product knowledge and industry understanding. As much as I am very, very kind of, you know, I get most trades now because we've got a really diverse sort of book of

different trades in trademark, I still have that kind of roadblock with understanding really technical product knowledge. So we very nearly didn't get it. And obviously, all I could say was, look, just wait till Jack's back and wait till we come and meet you. And you'll see, he's the trade, I'm the marketing. And then they kind of had a little bit of reassurance. But that's for us where it kind of comes in. I think at the beginning, you couldn't really see. I couldn't see what I was bringing to a marketing agency.

Laura (20:52)

Okay.

Okay.

Stacey & Jack (21:01)

And it a of an ego thing because obviously he just lost overnight pretty much his whole trade like his health was taking something away from him that he'd worked his whole life for to then be coming and starting something that was my forte and my baby which was the market and I understood it and I'm really fast paced he was like how am I gonna I don't want to be seen that I'm just

Don't understand it or I'm just trying to sit here watch you all day said I want it and then it took a few months for you to really find your yeah I mean, I really understand it now. I've got a great mentor So as far as mentors go sticks probably the best person to learn from because she's so Finicky and thorough with everything she does and she's quick at everything she does Yeah, as far as mentors go, it's a brilliant a brilliant one to learn from brilliant a brilliant a brilliant

I don't get away with anything. I'm not going into what she picks out of what I say. Brilliant. Yeah, but I've lost my train of thought now. Sorry.

Laura (22:02)

Oh,

Stacey & Jack (22:03)

No they've gone, when they're gone they're gone. Brilliant. That's the beauty of having the brain damaged, when it's gone it's gone. I have to shut up because they will go to me. Can I just, and I'm like no no one minute I'm just a minute to think and that's a big thing for me don't interrupt me because my brain and then he goes what are we doing and I'm like and then he goes stick you have to listen to me now because if you don't listen to me now I'm gonna forget what I'm about to say and I'm like, fair enough.

Laura (22:04)

Aww.

Hahaha!

bit like that definitely I start saying something and then I forget my own train of thought so then I have to pause and I'm like my god

Stacey & Jack (22:31)

Well, what was

going back to that, obviously you coming off the tools, was a big ego thing for you. Yes, as Stik said, obviously losing my trade overnight, it's back now. So basically, like my brains were rewired. It's like, the way they explain it is,

When you have a brain injury, you're, let's say you're in London and you want to go up north, you jump on the M1 and just jump on that road and go up north. That M1 is shut now. So your brain's.

rewiring itself to get to that destination again. And it's amazing, like as time's gone on, can not obviously feel it, but things come back and things stick. And so my trade, although I had lost a lot of it and the ability to just pick up tools and naturally quickly go about my business where I'd say build a wardrobe, I wouldn't have to think about it too much. I'd have to really, really think about it. And I feel like I'm back to where I was.

Laura (23:07)

Mmm.

Stacey & Jack (23:33)

with regards to working things out in my head. it's physically, isn't it? Physically, not what I was, but with like mentally, I would say, 90, 85, 90 % back to where I was. But you found your place in doing I found my place in this, yeah. So I understand what I bring, because at the start I was like, well, what am I going to bring to a marketing agency? She's like, honestly, like just...

Laura (23:41)

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (23:58)

go with the flow, you'll see what I mean. then like the more meetings we have and like Stig was just saying, we had that meeting the other day and I was explaining the product and what would be good to do it in this way and market it in this way. It works. Like I see it a lot more now what she was, what her vision was for it before we started this, you know? Yeah. Not quick on the laptop just yet, but. You're actually alright now. I'm not bad. The thing is I work.

Laura (24:17)

Amazing. That's great. Yeah, because I think... Yeah?

Stacey & Jack (24:26)

so quick, I can't even, I work so fast, my brain is so quick that he has no choice. And I think you're healing, you've had to just learn things really quickly. Yeah, she's like unusually quick though. There's not many people out there that brains work the same as sticks.

Yeah.

Laura (24:46)

Well, it's great to hear

that you're nearly back to 100 % And no you're welcome. I think I could definitely see instantly the value that you would bring to this duo without question, if I'm honest, because it's quite clear that Stick has got an exceptional marketing background from the stuff that I've seen. And I think having that link

Stacey & Jack (24:50)

Thank you.

Appreciate it. Thank you.

Laura (25:15)

As a trades person, without even knowing somebody, if you meet a trades person, you kind of already feel comfortable with them, don't you? You know, so I could definitely see why this duo would work 100%. And it obviously is working because as I said at the very beginning, you're absolutely everywhere and people are loving it. Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (25:23)

Yeah.

Yeah.

We're just trying to be ourselves. We like to

think that we're selling it on ourselves and marketing on ourselves. And it tends to be funny to watch. Yeah, we're selling, you're selling a movement rather than a service. not, we've had people phone up like recently saying, we don't even know what you do, but we want to be part of it. And I'm like, what do you mean we don't know what we do? They're like, we know you do something to do with marketing, but we don't really care. We just want to knock about with you two. I'm like, said, when you can sell your brand.

Laura (26:05)

Hahaha.

Stacey & Jack (26:09)

and you can sell you as people. You could sell any service like thereafter because that's the most important thing. You have to be likable. You have to have a really good brand behind you and you have to resonate with people. I think our story and the fact that we've never really, we put stuff up and we've had like relatives or like, you know, our mums would ring us and be like, that can't go up. And we're like, that's going up because it's us.

Laura (26:24)

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (26:36)

We're not here to pretend that we're anything other than what we are. We're our authentic selves. We have a really good connection, sort of on and off camera with our banter and the way that we are and how happy and fun we are. If we can translate that through to our business and then rub off on people and give people that energy, that in itself, if you could bottle that up and sell that, you know, that's what we want to bring to the table.

Laura (26:58)

Yeah.

Absolutely. And I think because trades people, in my opinion, are just so such down to earth people across the board that you marketing this business as yourselves and putting your real selves out there to be relatable to it, it's perfect because you're just down to earth.

Yeah, it's just so relatable. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, definitely.

Stacey & Jack (27:25)

Just normal people. Normal people having a go. Yeah,

and that's all we've ever done. We've only ever just been us. And it's important to us that we enjoy every minute of it. And also work with people that are aligned with us as well. We've made some friends in this industry that are more than just clients. They are our friends and we do things socially with them. you know, it's opened so many different

Laura (27:37)

yeah, absolutely.

oh wow

Stacey & Jack (27:53)

There's so much networking that goes on and it's so important to do that. But there's people that I know will be friends for life, men and women, you know, and that's lovely that in later life you know that you've met people along the way.

Laura (27:58)

Yeah.

Yeah, that's amazing. Because it is really hard to make true connections the older we get, isn't it?

Stacey & Jack (28:11)

Hmm

Yeah.

you end up losing connections the older you get, then your life gets in the way. You don't talk to your friends less. And then before you know it, you can count on one finger the amount of friends you've got.

Laura (28:20)

Yeah.

Yeah, definitely.

So what would you say is the most common mistake that you see us tradespeople make in regards to marketing ourselves and our businesses?

Stacey & Jack (28:45)

I'd say not utilizing the power of social media. And it's, suppose it's the reason why Trademark was born was because I think there is such a huge stigma and people have been so burned over the years with other services and websites and apps that promote they generate leads and they promote that they work in a certain way. They invest a lot of money, they don't see results and then they feel burnt by it.

Laura (28:48)

Yeah.

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (29:13)

Marketing as a whole, the biggest common misconception is that marketing is a quick fix or a quick overnight answer. Marketing is all about consistency, longevity and putting in constant effort, which takes time. So we never market ourselves as lead generating or growth anymore. At the beginning we did.

Laura (29:36)

OK.

Stacey & Jack (29:37)

But what we found was that there is such a high expectation amongst the trades because the trades is a very fast paced industry. It's very project led. So you're onto one thing and then onto the next thing and people want to see results quickly. it's always about, you know, it's a marathon, not a sprint. And I think that people need to understand that, you know, it doesn't just happen overnight. And I think that

Laura (29:45)

Mm.

Stacey & Jack (30:00)

There are some companies out there that will sell that. They will sell that they can be your quick fix. They then take a lot of your money. Then people pay it because they listen to the sales pitch, which is why from day one, we have never, ever, ever gone out there with a sales pitch. We identify the pain points, we identify the problem and we tell them how we get there by working backwards. We even do it as we put people on lower retainers and work our way up rather than starting high and working down when people aren't happy because

Laura (30:05)

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (30:29)

It takes time and there's a lot involved and we aren't a multi-billion pound agency with 40 members of staff. You we're a very small team. We've got internal structure in terms of like support with certain elements of marketing. But what people are investing in is the overall vision and we will dedicate a lot of time and energy into helping you. If you listen to the strategy that we can give you, then it will work.

Laura (30:31)

Yeah.

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (30:58)

Most of it is them putting in the consistency and the effort online. So they have to be patient and they've got to be willing to want to do it. As much as we can help and we can take a lot of the digital ag off of you, there's still going to need to be an element of you doing the doing part as well.

Laura (31:15)

Yeah, absolutely.

So what's next for Trademark? Have you got any big announcements or clients that you can share?

Stacey & Jack (31:23)

We're

in the full swing of event season, so we've got a lot of exciting trips coming up. There's always something going on. It's hard to keep up with how much we've... There's always something exciting happening that you can't specifically hone in on one exciting thing. So there's always something new happening and then we look back and we think, bloody hell.

Like these different little things, we look back in a couple of weeks time and think, bloody hell, like if you actually go through that last couple of weeks, and it tends to happen constantly, doesn't it? If you go back and look at the last couple of weeks, you think, bloody hell, like so much has happened. I feel like we're at that stage in our business as well where there's so much going on that at the beginning, like we used to celebrate the tiny little wins because we were like, we've been working so hard for this, like continuously. But now because every day something happens and every day they're so exciting, it's really overwhelming and that's really

Laura (32:06)

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (32:15)

hard to, we are really good at sitting down at the end of the day and like recapping and I'm gonna make more of a conscious effort to do it. We try and do it like on a Sunday or over the weekend, we sort of plan for the week ahead. I have to have a plan otherwise my whole week turns to shit so like I must drive Jack mad but I'm like right can we just sit down. Everything's a plan. Everything's a plan but it has to be because of how busy we are and how limited we are in time.

Laura (32:21)

Good.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (32:44)

And it's happening in such a short space of time as well. said to Stik the other day, do remember when we first started this company? So I was building a sunbed shop, she was sitting in the corner on the laptop, this is in the middle of winter as well, like shivering, building up trademark. And we used to just walk into places selling our services. Yeah, which we haven't done for a long while. But I said to Stik, when we was doing that at the time, I used to say, we're gonna look back.

Laura (33:03)

Fair play.

Stacey & Jack (33:10)

And be like, do remember when we used to just cold call walking into places, walking into shops and selling the services and just getting like shrugged out of there with a lot of them and.

Laura (33:18)

You've got to start from somewhere,

haven't you? And it's like the old school movement of when you first start up as a trades person, how do you find your business? And one of the easiest ways to get clients, leaflets, know, get them printed, post them through doors. of business. Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (33:34)

Yeah.

it's networking, like you have

to be and that's one bit of advice that I'd give to anybody in the trades no matter what you do or whether you're a creator or you're not a creator and you just are a tradesman that isn't present online, be in as many places as you can, be at as many trade shows, trade days, surround yourself with the brands because every conversation is an opportunity and that's in personal growth, business growth, digital growth.

you will grow as a person because if you are the company you keep, surround yourself with people that have energy and passion for the trades and support movements like the Stolen Tools movement, the mental health kind of movement. There's so many influential people in this industry who give so much of their time and energy to better the community that we're in.

And it's so inspirational, and to be around those people, you're only gonna grow, you're only gonna better yourself. Yeah, the power of networking, I didn't really understand it at the start, the power of networking is phenomenal. Yeah, and that is a good bit of advice, just be everywhere. And it's worked for us, because that's one bit of feedback that we get off of everybody we talk to is, you guys are everywhere. You're everywhere, how are you everywhere? One minute you're in Coventry, then you're in Wales, then you're

Laura (34:39)

Bye.

There you go.

Stacey & Jack (34:56)

but you have to be and it's hard. There's sacrifice to be made. We've both got children. I have to sit there and my kids cry when I leave because I'm mummy and I'm not there a lot, but it's all for the greater good and we have to do this now, especially at this stage in our business. You're laying the foundations.

Laura (35:01)

Yep.

Yeah, it's building stage, isn't it? So, you know, it's all about putting in the time.

Stacey & Jack (35:22)

don't need to do it. was like when I've got three kids and my little girl, my youngest, she was a week old and we was on our way up to Birmingham for an event, wasn't we? Installer, yeah. Installer, yeah. It was touch and go, whether I was going to make it, but obviously, yeah, I did. But she was a week. But you have to, you got to, you know, it's the guilt, but like we wouldn't be where we are now if the stuff that hadn't happened in May, June, July, like we have to do it, you have to do it.

Laura (35:37)

Wow.

Stacey & Jack (35:46)

like any tradie like it's the hardest grafted industry across the board, whether you're on the tools or whether you're in the, you know, the background and digital like we are, it's one of them industries that everybody you speak to grafts for it. And I'm fully here for that. Yeah. You get out what you put in. Unless you finish at half twelve.

Laura (36:06)

Half day, half day.

Stacey & Jack (36:07)

Half day, full day pay, is it?

Laura (36:08)

Yeah, absolutely. I right in saying that you guys are going to be at the P &D show in November?

Stacey & Jack (36:15)

We're going to be at P &D show, we're at Tool Fair, we're on the Tools Awards, we're at the Talking Tradesman Christmas Party, we're at Installer Festival. There's lots, but we're at all of them. for anyone that kind of sees that, and that's another thing as well, we speak to so many people online and you know them by their Instagram handles or their Facebook name. if anyone like this sounds really like...

Laura (36:24)

Mmm.

my sin.

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (36:41)

Not big headed, but if you see us, come and talk to us. have so many people message us after events saying, we saw you, but we felt rude coming up to you. Please, we have worked for this. We love everybody in this industry. We wouldn't be here now if it wasn't for the people that have supported us on the social media. Please come and say hello, because it hurts my feelings when you message us after and say, we didn't want to come up to you because you looked busy. Come and say hi. We're so approachable.

Laura (37:11)

Well, I will be one of those people at the P &D show, because I will be going. So I'll come and see you and we'll get a picture together and whatnot. yeah, definitely.

Stacey & Jack (37:16)

⁓ boy. It's good to say,

We will do. And

just thank you so and you as well. Like you've started something up that's a risk and it's quite it's becoming a very oversaturated industry, the podcast industry. But it's you making yourself different. You know, you are you're different to what everybody else is doing. Have your own brand, have your own niche, be you and you will succeed if you just keep putting the effort in and get the right people on who are inspiring and people will want to listen to.

You've had some really influential people on your podcast and if you carry on doing that, you're only going to grow.

Laura (37:56)

Thank you. That's very kind of you. Yeah. All my guests I've had so far have been incredible and the little bits of feedback I get here and there, it makes it all worth it. Cause at the end of the day, I'm giving up my spare time to share what these people have to say. And I just love it. I love hearing everybody's different stories and their journeys. And I hope people that listening to this enjoy it as well.

Stacey & Jack (38:24)

Me too. Well,

yeah, congratulations. I'm sure you're going to smash it. So yeah, just keep doing what you're doing.

Laura (38:29)

Thank you.

And you guys, and you guys for sure. play a little game with you because I play it with all my other guests and it's just a bit of fun. a quick fire question round. Stik, if you go first, tea or coffee?

Stacey & Jack (38:41)

Okay.

Tea

Laura (38:47)

Stories or Reels?

Stacey & Jack (38:48)

Oh, oh, it's a really hard one. I love a story because I think they're more, they're more like personable and they're more like just unedited. So it's raw. But then I do love a reel... This isn't quick fire. I know, but I said that's not asking it. You're like, oh, stories. Yeah.

Laura (38:59)

That's okay.

stories, driver

or passenger.

Stacey & Jack (39:06)

I'm a control freak, so I like driving.

Laura (39:09)

Me too. Instagram or LinkedIn.

Stacey & Jack (39:11)

This is really hard insta!

Laura (39:13)

Order in or eat out.

Stacey & Jack (39:16)

Oh, eat out. We have to eat out a lot with what we do. yeah, eating out. Food's my love language. I love eating out and yeah.

Laura (39:26)

Fair play. And last one, a text message or a phone call.

Stacey & Jack (39:30)

Phone call. The art of communication is lost through text. Voice note or phone call.

Laura (39:35)

Cool. All right, Jack, your turn. Driver or passenger?

Stacey & Jack (39:37)

Yeah. Yeah.

Driver.

Laura (39:41)

Tea or coffee?

Stacey & Jack (39:43)

coffee.

Laura (39:43)

Early start or late finish.

Stacey & Jack (39:46)

Late finish. I was early start to be honest. I was always early, but the last sort of like last two years, I'm a late starter. So I would have, if you'd have asked me that two years ago, I'd have said early start, but yeah, now late finish. think as well because we do a lot of late ones because the trades that we work with finish work on site and then they want to meet or then they want to sit down when they're off site and then all of our meetings start. So we tend to have...

Laura (39:48)

watch ya.

Yeah, bit of a lying.

Stacey & Jack (40:13)

Our working day, because we've both got the kids and we do the school run, we tend to do late finishes because it just works around business a bit better, doesn't it?

Laura (40:22)

Gotcha, it's nice to have that flexibility for sure. Sweet. Next one, last one. I'm gonna ask you Instagram or LinkedIn.

Stacey & Jack (40:25)

It a good question. That is a good question. What's the next one?

So I'm going to say Instagram because I enjoy it more, it depends what you need from it. LinkedIn is more important for certain things. Instagram is more important for certain things. So as a company, it all would depend. But yeah, I'd say for me personally, Instagram.

Laura (40:50)

Cool, lovely, thank you. do always ask this question at the end of my shows and I'm interested first of all to see what Sticks says If you could be a tradie, what trade would you choose and why?

Stacey & Jack (40:52)

Yeah.

I would be...

It's really difficult because two of the most influential people in my life in the trades are Jack and Mary because of, obviously I've watched both of them so closely. the things, how you can with carpentry, how you can visualise something in your head and then see it as a finished piece. Like we're sitting in now and there's like a resin table. Like that was just an idea and then it's now a piece of furniture. So it's the journey. And the same thing with Mary, like

Laura (41:37)

Nice.

Stacey & Jack (41:39)

I have seen the impact that that girl has had on people by the outcome of the end product. And it's such an under saturated traditional craft. Like it's almost inspiring. Her pieces aren't just finished products. They are inspiring pieces of like a room. So I dunno, like I feel like I'd be taken away. I'm so grateful for what I've learned by watching Jack over the years.

But I also know how hard it is to be a carpenter because I've unloaded that van so many times. It's not an easy life. Like picking up a cold toolbox and tools and loading like, hop-ups and stuff. No, I don't think I could do it. You need so much tools to do it. It's like with Mary's stuff. She just rocks up to a workshop and everything's there and she doesn't have to really go on site a lot. I think because I'm quite lazy, I think I just want... far from laziness. Yeah, no, but I don't really want to be in and out of a van.

Yeah, I'll get I of like an electrician, think being on site with the boys, like plumbing, that is an Aggie trade, like being a plumber. wouldn't be a plumber. Yeah, I'd say that I'm going to give kudos to my girl and I'd say what Mary does because it's traditional, it's inspiring and it's bloody messy and I love it.

Laura (42:49)

Amazing. Yeah, absolutely. And Jack, if you could be a different trade, what would you choose?

Stacey & Jack (42:56)

a

different trade. I reckon I would probably go down the route of

Laura (42:58)

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (43:06)

I'd say electrics. I would go back to that. Yeah, because it's not as messy. You earn good money doing it. All trades are hard, so I'm not taking anything away from anyone, but I know it's a little easier on your body ⁓ than carpentry, you know. Yeah, I think it would probably be electrics. I would have said plumbing and gas, but I've done a couple of days for my cousin, and that is a hard life. That's real hard life, although they earn...

Laura (43:08)

Okay.

Yeah.

Yeah?

Stacey & Jack (43:31)

really good money, they deserve it for what they do. So yeah, I second that. I think coming from a no knowledge in the trade, not no knowledge, but the hands on knowledge to seeing how hard plumbers work. Yeah. And also you've got to go home and stress because you fire up someone's, you fire up the water in someone's house and go home and hope that every single fitting that you've done and every single connection that you've done ain't going to leak. That's stress. So I was talking to my cousin about it the other day.

Laura (43:36)

There you go

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (44:00)

And he says, he was saying what he does is he gets the water on as quick as possible and then he'll go around finishing the other stuff that he can finish after that. So then he's there for that. he's there for that. Cause he's been doing my house recently. So he said, basically got the water fired up as quick as possible. And then I'd run around doing the other bits that I can do when the water's flowing in case something bursts and floods the house. So I'll go with electrics. Yeah, I think. What about you, Lau

Laura (44:08)

you

Yeah.

Cool.

Do you know, I would be a carpenter. yeah, I've dabbled in bits. I've made a couple of tables and coffee tables out of leftover oak work, solid oak work top. And yeah, I love creating. It is.

Stacey & Jack (44:41)

Yeah.

It's a fun trade. It is a fun

trade and it's a really, really rewarding trade. everything's on show with it. There's no room for error.

Laura (44:51)

Yeah,

that's of my close friends. He's a carpenter and he's extremely good. And when I watch or when I've. I can do, yeah, it's he's actually an electrician as well as a carpenter, so he combines the two. Yeah, and he does kitchen fitting as well, so he's.

Stacey & Jack (45:00)

Do you wanna name drop him?

Skilled man.

Laura (45:12)

Yeah, it really molds the two together.

Stacey & Jack (45:14)

Drop his Instagram handling.

Laura (45:16)

I will do is it's PDM electrics and kitchen fitting is his name's Pete and he's brilliant. He's absolutely spot on and he's fitted numerous kitchens for me in properties and for my dad as well. And he's just Bob on

Stacey & Jack (45:21)

Okay.

Yeah. Yeah.

It's a brilliant skill to have. Like the money that you save on your own house doing it, it's phenomenal.

Laura (45:36)

It is.

⁓ yeah. And then when you see the likes of

Chippy Em doing the structural carpentry, that's just...

Stacey & Jack (45:49)

Yeah, there's so many elements to carpentry like you learn forever. So you got to pick what route you want to go down. you can go down the road of like structural carpentry on sites, getting it prepared for concrete and that is a hard life. That is a real hard life. But you can go down the road of being a joiner and fitting wardrobes and making wardrobes and making kitchens or fitting kitchens. There's so many routes to take.

Laura (46:06)

Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (46:17)

in carpentry and joinery that you need to find the one that you enjoy and go down that because you won't learn the whole lot in your whole lifetime.

Laura (46:23)

Yeah,

definitely.

Stacey & Jack (46:25)

but I do love it. I love, I definitely picked the right trade, but Stick is right. You need so many tools for it. You need to get all them tools. So the way we used to do it, we used to turn up at the yard, we'd load the van up, we'd load obviously what we needed. If we've made something, we might've made a wardrobe or whatever we was doing. You'd have to go to site, unload the van, do your day's work, load the van back up, go back down to the yard, unload it again, and it's a process.

Laura (46:51)

Yeah, isn't it? Yeah.

Stacey & Jack (46:53)

but it is a very rewarding trade.

Laura (46:56)

Definitely.

Stacey & Jack (46:57)

and a great skill to have.

Laura (46:59)

On that note then, what trade or who do you think I should have on the show next?

Stacey & Jack (47:04)

Mary's done a bit with you. Okay, so Ria? Ria, have you had Rhea on?

Laura (47:04)

Mary's been on yep.

I've got it lined up.

Stacey & Jack (47:14)

Yeah, you have actually, she was in your secret. Do you know, I haven't actually watched all of it, but branded by Sammy.

Laura (47:22)

yes!

Stacey & Jack (47:23)

So Sammy does all of the workwear for the industry and I know she's just done Trade Legends and I've watched a few of the clips and I think there's more to Sammy than what people realise that she's got a very good backstory and she's been through a lot and brief encounters at shows and stuff. She's got a few mutual friends, but I'd say Sammy does a lot for the industry and has come a very long way in a short space of time. So I'd say Sammy would be a good one.

Laura (47:25)

Yes.

Perfect. I will get back onto her then, because she's actually printing me some merch as well. So there you go. Absolutely.

Stacey & Jack (47:55)

There you go. Invite her on. Get her on.

And good luck with Ria She's a good egg, that girl. Yeah, she's good stuff, Ria.

Laura (48:03)

Thank you. Awesome. So where can people find you on social media and everywhere?

Stacey & Jack (48:10)

So Instagram is trademarkdigitaluk, www.trademarkdigital.co.uk. Jack's phone number is 07... 078... 078, 012121. Yeah, but it's just put into trademark digital marketing and we come up in most places now, so that's good. Yeah.

Laura (48:19)

Hahaha!

ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ⁓

Perfect. Well, I won't.

Stacey & Jack (48:36)

Thank you

so, so, so much for your time and we've thoroughly enjoyed that. Thank you.

Laura (48:39)

you too. Good,

you're welcome. I'll make sure that all the links and website and handles and everything are in the show notes for the episode. So it's easy for people to find. And yeah, thank you very much for giving me your time, you two very busy people.

Stacey & Jack (48:51)

Thank you. Thank you.

No problem at

all. We thoroughly enjoyed ourselves. It's been a nice little boost for today.